Bob Dixon interviews Teresa Schlosser, a retired veteran with almost three decades of service and a Five Eagles Leadership coach. Bob and Teresa discuss what it is like to develop great cultures within organizations. Drawing on their extensive military leadership experience, they discuss the complexities of toxic leadership, effective strategies for navigating challenging leadership situations, and the organic formation of subcultures within larger organizations, including the powerful and sometimes unpredictable “E four Mafia”.

They emphasize the importance of clearly defined values, consistent accountability, and the critical role of leadership presence in shaping a positive and productive environment. Teresa also shares her perspective on balancing kindness with the necessity of holding people accountable, highlighting the effectiveness of direct yet respectful communication. This episode offers valuable lessons for leaders at all levels looking to build strong, value-driven cultures and navigate the messy but rewarding world of leading people.

About Teresa Schlosser:

Teresa retired from the US Army after 28 years as an Engineer Officer. She served four operational and combat tours in the Balkans, the Philippine Islands, Afghanistan, and Iraq. She led troops at every level from a 67-soldier platoon to the 3,500-person Engineer Research & Development Center (ERDC), the premier research and development center for the US Army Corps of Engineers.

She lives in Vicksburg, MS, and is available for speaking engagements, professional coaching, and leadership mentoring opportunities.

Key Takeaways:

• There are two forms of toxic leadership: the obvious abusive leader and the “nice guy” leader who fails to hold subordinates accountable, which can foster toxicity within the organization.
• When working for a toxic leader, it’s generally advisable to focus on doing your best work, protecting your team, addressing issues privately when necessary, and understanding the risks involved in public confrontation.
• Leaders must be deliberate about defining and communicating their values and should lead by example, as their actions are constantly observed.
• Subcultures can develop organically within organizations, and while they can be beneficial, leaders need to be aware of their potential to deviate from the overall organizational culture, as exemplified by the “E four Mafia”.
• A key element missing in many private sector organizations is the equivalent of a Sergeant Major, a senior advisor who provides a critical feedback loop from lower ranks and can offer candid, sometimes difficult, truths to the leader.
• Kindness in leadership should not be mistaken for weakness; effective leaders can be both compassionate and firm in upholding standards and holding people accountable.
• The need to be liked should not take precedence over the responsibility of enforcing standards and ensuring the job gets done correctly and safely.
• Effective accountability involves clear communication of standards and expectations, and corrections can be made respectfully without resorting to cruelty or demeaning behavior.

Quotes from Teresa Schlosser in this episode:

“I love people. People are messy, but they’re so much fun to interact with and it’s such a, you know, it’s such an honor to be able to help them be better.”

“So you have to tell them who you are and what you expect, and then follow through and you have to live your example that. You have to expect that you are always being seen by someone.”

“You can correct people without ever being cruel and you, you should never be because that’s what breaks trust.”